# Foojay Podcast #41: Web Development with Java

> Do you really need JavaScript frameworks? Why would you not just stick to Java and use one of the many great libraries that are available for it?

- URL: https://foojay.io/today/foojay-podcast-41/
- Published: 2024-01-29
- Authors: Frank Delporte, Marcus Hellberg
- Categories: Podcast, Vaadin


When starting to build a new website, you are facing a major challenge. Which framework should you use? Angular, React, Vue, Svelte? They are all based on JavaScript and can be the right choice depending on your needs.

But... do you really need one of these frameworks? Why would you not just stick to Java and use one of the many great libraries that are available for it?

## Video

{{< youtube aaYs7zqaBO8 >}}

## Podcast Apps

You can listen and subscribe to the Foojay Podcast on:

* [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/6CpTfgn9LirzJGAtc4ICdQ)
* [Apple Podcasts](https://podcasts.apple.com/be/podcast/foojay-io-the-friends-of-openjdk/id1652281304)
* And most others...

## Guests

### Martijn Dashorst

* <https://www.linkedin.com/in/dashorst/>
* <https://mastodon.social/@dashorst>
* <https://twitter.com/dashorst>
* <https://martijndashorst.com>

### Marcus Hellberg

* <https://www.linkedin.com/in/marcushellberg/>
* <https://mstdn.social/@marcushellberg>
* <https://twitter.com/marcushellberg>
* <https://marcushellberg.dev/>

## Podcast

Host: Frank Delporte

* <https://foojay.social/@frankdelporte>[](https://foojay.social/@frankdelporte)
* <https://www.linkedin.com/in/frankdelporte/>

![](podcast-guests-web-development-1024x576.jpg)

## Links

### Wicket

* <https://wicket.apache.org/>
* <https://builtwithwicket.tumblr.com>
* <https://nightlies.apache.org/wicket/guide/10.x/single.html>
* <https://wicket.apache.org/start/quickstart.html>
* <https://wicket.apache.org/learn/#migrations>
* <https://github.com/apache/wicket>
* <https://twitter.com/apache_wicket>

### Vaadin

* <https://vaadin.com/>
* <https://start.vaadin.com>
* <https://github.com/vaadin/>
* <https://vaadin.com/components>
* <https://twitter.com/vaadin>
* <https://foojay.io/?s=vaadin>
* <https://foojay.io/today/video-vaadin-drag-drop-support-its-so-easy/>
* <https://foojay.io/today/enterprise-java-application-development-with-jakarta-ee-and-vaadin/>
* <https://foojay.io/today/how-to-style-a-vaadin-application/>
* <https://foojay.io/today/blink-a-led-on-raspberry-pi-with-vaadin/>

### Thymeleaf / htmx

* <https://www.thymeleaf.org/>
* <https://htmx.org/>
* <https://foojay.io/today/book-review-modern-frontends-with-htmx/>
* <https://foojay.io/today/new-book-taming-thymeleaf/>
* <https://foojay.io/today/controlling-an-lcd-display-with-spring-and-thymeleaf-on-the-raspberry-pi/>

## Content

00:00 Introduction of the topic and guests  

01:37 About Apache Wicket  

03:26 About Vaadin  

06:37 How these frameworks exchange data between server and client  

09:38 Comparing to Thymeleaf  

11:16 About htmx  
<https://foojay.io/today/book-review-modern-frontends-with-htmx/>   

14:42 How the Apache Foundation works  
<https://apache.org/>   

19:20 License model of Vaadin  

21:26 Wicket and Vaadin "in the wild"  
<https://vaadin.com/blog/liukuri-uses-vaadin-flow-to-help-finnish-households-navigate-the-energy-crisis>   
<https://liukuri.fi/>   
<https://api.pi4j.com/>   
<https://4drums.media/>   

26:03 Java developers can build full web applications with only Java without being full-stack  

27:47 Could JavaFX become a web-development framework?  

29:35 About WebComponents  

32:14 How the company Vaadin is making money from opensource  

34:31 The future of Wicket, htmx, Vaadin,…  

39:55 Which kind of project to build with Wicket or Vaadin  

46:18 Links   

48:54 Searching Vaadin docs with AI  
<https://marcushellberg.dev/how-to-build-a-custom-chatgpt-assistant-for-your-documentation>   

51:21 Conclusions

## Music

* Barbershop John
* Hermine Deurloo
* Synapse by Shane Ivers - <https://www.silvermansound.com>